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Update - 9th March 2013 
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Post Re: Update - 9th March 2013
Lets get back to topic and stay there...

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Mon Mar 11, 2013 6:05 pm
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Post Re: Update - 9th March 2013
-C00- wrote:
No no no no no docta, he's not saying he added an extra 20%, he's saying it's now UP TO 15%. The regular tekk rate for all non advanced classes is 10%, with advanced it's 15% and elite is now 20%.

EDIT: also it's impossible for pso weapons to have over 100% hit, because if it does when you log out the weapon will revert back to 100%. Schthack hasn't been able to fix this. Maybe you have though.

Also I'd like to note that there is a glitch with item making that if you have 100% hit, the weapon will miss every single hit (even normals)


Yes i am fully aware of the bonuses (normal +10%, advanced +15% and elite +20%), re-read what i've typed and you'll see this is exactly what i've said.

Spoghead wrote:
Further, the extra 10% on top of normal elites can get is enough to make it easier to obtain Kure's Deal items.


Yea this was my point, don't you think it makes it too easy now? The troll tier is a lot more accessible now (which wasn't it's purpose). That extra 10% may not seem like much but it crosses a threshold that shit like Tofu's ticket's don't, the troll tier was designed with two premises in mind: 1) Tofu's ticket's couldn't be used to cross the 50% mark. 2) The actual chance of obtaining something like a 60 hit weapon was as rare as a sober Bushie, i mean it really wouldn't occur very often. Now though a 40 hit weapon can be tekk'd to 60. The idea behind the troll tier was to gawk at those weapons and wish for them, with one being obtained very very rarely(if at all).

I think if editing the Kure ji's troll tier requirements is out of the question then the name should probably be changed to something like diamond tier, cos there's nothing trollish about it for an elite. Of course you guys are the head honchos and it's ultimately up to Trys and Tofu what gets implemented into the server, just putting forward my 20 pence and pointing out what other areas those changes affect.

(Totally off topic but can new meshes be added to pso or the current ones edited? i remember reading a tiny bit about it, at least the vertices having to match up to the original ones and that was the least of the problems. Really haven't read much about it and was just wondering if you knew anything about it.)

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Tue Mar 12, 2013 1:37 am
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Post Re: Update - 9th March 2013
Docta wrote:
Tofu's ticket's couldn't be used to cross the 50% mark

I am totaly agree with that, because it will just break the hunts.
Docta wrote:
The actual chance of obtaining something like a 60 hit weapon was as rare as a sober Bushie

Is it just possible ?

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Tue Mar 12, 2013 3:40 am
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Post Re: Update - 9th March 2013
roronoa58 wrote:
Docta wrote:
Tofu's ticket's couldn't be used to cross the 50% mark

I am totaly agree with that, because it will just break the hunts.
Docta wrote:
The actual chance of obtaining something like a 60 hit weapon was as rare as a sober Bushie

Is it just possible ?

I sold a 60h caliber I found to bushie

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Tue Mar 12, 2013 5:45 am
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Post Re: Update - 9th March 2013
roronoa58 wrote:
I am totaly agree with that, because it will just break the hunts.


Yes, although i once thought those tofu tickets were rare but after hearing how many of them folk have gathered, maybe they are not so rare

roronoa58 wrote:
Is it just possible ?


Well, what i mean by that is finding a 50 hit untekked weapon and tekking it to 60, this is a very rare occurrence and that was the point really, making the weapons extremely exclusive to the point where no one might own any or if your lucky, one might exist on the server. Think of the troll tier as not really a part of Kure ji's deal if that makes any sense, kure ji's deal was made then that was added on to it on the assumption that (chances are) no one is really gonna manage to get them anyway. Having a few of those weapons kicking around on the server is madness of course, which is why the requirements were so damned crazy. Now with the +10% extra tekking power of an elite, that has pretty much taken 20% (in most cases) off the requirements for those troll tier weapons, making them much easier to obtain. Anyway i feel like i am repeating myself or i am talking an unfamiliar language.

I would propose raising the requirements for the troll tier, some of them by 10% (that way you can have the benefit of that extra 10% and have it not affect the troll tier weapons), but i know that ain't gonna happen, and the reason for that is that people will contest this. Most people hate nerfs in any way, people are always quick to applaud buffs but even mention the word nerf and the pitchforks come out, in fact most people if they had it their way want the game as easy as possible, some wouldn't even mind if they got the shit spawned for them without any effort.

Think of all the buffs the weapons have had on eden over the course of its history, the weapons and equipment get buff after buff and yet the enemies don't, shit just gets easier and easier. Nerfing stuff makes the game more challenging and challenge breeds longevity meaning people are more likely to play for longer periods of time and over the course, the game will have a longer life span.

Anyway i've digressed more than intended, maybe i am just a hard ass on stuff (not gonna lie i enjoy it xD) i believe nerfing is essential now and then, y'all got it too easy imo. I think i've blabbered enough about it so i'll shut my gob now.

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Tue Mar 12, 2013 6:05 am
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Post Re: Update - 9th March 2013
Honestly, I would not oppose this. The main reason why I even bothered going after Troll Tier Heaven Striker in the first place is I've heard people say time and time again, "there's no way anyone's going to get any of the weapons on this list." It was a challenge, to me. I already have a Gold Tier weapon, and I'm still working on that troll tier. Though, this percentage increase for Advances/Elites does take away some of the strain of finding the required pieces to make a Troll Tier (or Gold Tier, for that matter).

(I had all the ingredients before except for the 55h Mille Marteaux, but then I traded a lot of it away. I needed things. >_> Don't judge me!)

I can see this being beneficial to some players who might possibly be going after Gold/Troll tier weapons. It makes it seem like what was so far out of reach now has a tiny light shed on possible. On the other hand, I can agree with docta. It was named 'Troll Tier' because of how far out of your way you'd have to go to get that ridiculously delicious looking weapon. At the end of it, one could say they feel 'Troll Tier Worthy'. Now you can just turn to your local Advance/Elite player and ask them to tekk some of the prerequisites for you (I can see this turning into a paid service).

I don't think it has TOO much of an impact on Kure-ji's Deal, however. There still comes the effort of having to find the weapons you need for a Troll Tier/Gold Tier item (as well as any extras if one of the requirements has a combination weapon). Then of course, if you find the item you need, but it doesn't have the hit percentage you need, you need vouchers. There is no telling how many vouchers you'll need (I needed 35, at one time. :(...). Vouchers do not appear often, either. The amount of time it takes to potentially get a couple of vouches could all be bunched up with two Heaven Punisher hunts and a Heaven Striker hunt (provided you don't have these, already. Ruling out Happy Hour and Chosen One).

That's thirty vouchers right there, if none of the weapons come with hit. Sure, getting a Calibur from 40% untekked hit to 60% is doable with Elites running around, but you still have to find a PGF (the DAR LIES! LIES, I TELL YOU!). Then there's still the challenge of making your Gold Tier weapon before you consider anything else (Le Cogneur, for example). This percentage increase, based on experience from trying to get this Troll Tier before (and trying again, now!), has a small impact.

But that's just how I feel about it.

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Tue Mar 12, 2013 10:13 am
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Post Re: Update - 9th March 2013
Zacchaeus wrote:
Honestly, I would not oppose this. The main reason why I even bothered going after Troll Tier Heaven Striker in the first place is I've heard people say time and time again, "there's no way anyone's going to get any of the weapons on this list." It was a challenge, to me. I already have a Gold Tier weapon, and I'm still working on that troll tier. Though, this percentage increase for Advances/Elites does take away some of the strain of finding the required pieces to make a Troll Tier (or Gold Tier, for that matter).

(I had all the ingredients before except for the 55h Mille Marteaux, but then I traded a lot of it away. I needed things. >_> Don't judge me!)

I can see this being beneficial to some players who might possibly be going after Gold/Troll tier weapons. It makes it seem like what was so far out of reach now has a tiny light shed on possible. On the other hand, I can agree with docta. It was named 'Troll Tier' because of how far out of your way you'd have to go to get that ridiculously delicious looking weapon. At the end of it, one could say they feel 'Troll Tier Worthy'. Now you can just turn to your local Advance/Elite player and ask them to tekk some of the prerequisites for you (I can see this turning into a paid service).

I don't think it has TOO much of an impact on Kure-ji's Deal, however. There still comes the effort of having to find the weapons you need for a Troll Tier/Gold Tier item (as well as any extras if one of the requirements has a combination weapon). Then of course, if you find the item you need, but it doesn't have the hit percentage you need, you need vouchers. There is no telling how many vouchers you'll need (I needed 35, at one time. :(...). Vouchers do not appear often, either. The amount of time it takes to potentially get a couple of vouches could all be bunched up with two Heaven Punisher hunts and a Heaven Striker hunt (provided you don't have these, already. Ruling out Happy Hour and Chosen One).

That's thirty vouchers right there, if none of the weapons come with hit. Sure, getting a Calibur from 40% untekked hit to 60% is doable with Elites running around, but you still have to find a PGF (the DAR LIES! LIES, I TELL YOU!). Then there's still the challenge of making your Gold Tier weapon before you consider anything else (Le Cogneur, for example). This percentage increase, based on experience from trying to get this Troll Tier before (and trying again, now!), has a small impact.

But that's just how I feel about it.


this^^^^


Docta if you're gonna put a "troll" tier up there, and yet make them seemingly impossible to get why would you put them into Kures in the first place. It would be the most pointless thing in this game other than the 4th trap they didn't put into casts.

It doesn't make it too easy because you still have to find a weapon thats 10% away from 60-65 hit, or 15% away thats UNTEKKED.

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Tue Mar 12, 2013 11:20 am
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Post Re: Update - 9th March 2013
Zacchaeus wrote:
Honestly, I would not oppose this. The main reason why I even bothered going after Troll Tier Heaven Striker in the first place is I've heard people say time and time again, "there's no way anyone's going to get any of the weapons on this list." It was a challenge, to me. I already have a Gold Tier weapon, and I'm still working on that troll tier. Though, this percentage increase for Advances/Elites does take away some of the strain of finding the required pieces to make a Troll Tier (or Gold Tier, for that matter).

(I had all the ingredients before except for the 55h Mille Marteaux, but then I traded a lot of it away. I needed things. >_> Don't judge me!)

I can see this being beneficial to some players who might possibly be going after Gold/Troll tier weapons. It makes it seem like what was so far out of reach now has a tiny light shed on possible. On the other hand, I can agree with docta. It was named 'Troll Tier' because of how far out of your way you'd have to go to get that ridiculously delicious looking weapon. At the end of it, one could say they feel 'Troll Tier Worthy'. Now you can just turn to your local Advance/Elite player and ask them to tekk some of the prerequisites for you (I can see this turning into a paid service).

I don't think it has TOO much of an impact on Kure-ji's Deal, however. There still comes the effort of having to find the weapons you need for a Troll Tier/Gold Tier item (as well as any extras if one of the requirements has a combination weapon). Then of course, if you find the item you need, but it doesn't have the hit percentage you need, you need vouchers. There is no telling how many vouchers you'll need (I needed 35, at one time. :(...). Vouchers do not appear often, either. The amount of time it takes to potentially get a couple of vouches could all be bunched up with two Heaven Punisher hunts and a Heaven Striker hunt (provided you don't have these, already. Ruling out Happy Hour and Chosen One).

That's thirty vouchers right there, if none of the weapons come with hit. Sure, getting a Calibur from 40% untekked hit to 60% is doable with Elites running around, but you still have to find a PGF (the DAR LIES! LIES, I TELL YOU!). Then there's still the challenge of making your Gold Tier weapon before you consider anything else (Le Cogneur, for example). This percentage increase, based on experience from trying to get this Troll Tier before (and trying again, now!), has a small impact.

But that's just how I feel about it.


Good post, i agree that a lot of effort still has to go into hunting the weapons in the first place, i think the original Kure ji's was far too easy(even without the new Tofu tickets), but again maybe that's just down to my mentality. Also the Tofu tickets weren't really designed for tekking a weapon from 0% to 50%, while it is possible it is also a bit stupid to do, unless you traded for the tickets then you are wasting a lot of time.


-C00- wrote:
this^^^^

Docta if you're gonna put a "troll" tier up there, and yet make them seemingly impossible to get why would you put them into Kures in the first place. It would be the most pointless thing in this game other than the 4th trap they didn't put into casts.

It doesn't make it too easy because you still have to find a weapon thats 10% away from 60-65 hit, or 15% away thats UNTEKKED.


I've said pretty much what i've wanted to do on it, however like i said, those weapons are ridiculous and thus the requirements should be ridiculous, they shouldn't even be on the server and hence why i said they are mainly there to gawk at (with the tiniest chance of one day maybe obtaining them).

Maybe your right, maybe it should be taken off Kure ji's deal. I just think people tent to act tightly wound when someone is opposed to constant boosts, nothing wrong with a nerf now and then, the game is already damn easy. In any case it's just a discussion, it's not an "OMG everything going to shit", just putting my opinion forward such as it may be.

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Tue Mar 12, 2013 11:53 am
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Post Re: Update - 9th March 2013
I imagine this rendition of Kure-ji's Deal was to add a challenge to an already easy game (sans the difficult quests that exist and Challenge Mode). There's a difference between "seemingly impossible" and "completely impossible". Kure-ji's Deal MKII is NOT completely impossible, and "seemingly impossible" is a debatable category to place this deal in. As I've stated before, I've been a stone's throw away once before. I see nothing that is disabling me from getting that close, again.

With that being said, the requirements are still ridiculous (take this as a compliment!), but me attempting to go through with a Troll Tier weapon to its completion means that it is far from even looking impossible. You just have to be willing to put forth the work to make it happen. Just like getting any weapon in this game that requires a little work.

As far as the vouchers go, I wouldn't say you're completely wasting your time, as spending said time in the casino to obtain the vouchers will be well worth the effort you put into getting one of these weapons. Trading for vouchers is also good yes, but that requires 20 to 25PDs a piece, like what most people have been doing, lately. At this rate, you could go either route-- either spending the time in the casino to get vouchers, or saving up enough Photon Drops to trade to get vouchers.

By doing that though, if you plan on sphering said weapon (If it isn't Troll Tier Excalibur), you're prolonging that opportunity. Oh, and...

-C00- wrote:
Docta if you're gonna put a "troll" tier up there, and yet make them seemingly impossible to get why would you put them into Kures in the first place.


I think the name of the Tier explains itself, with this one. :p

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Tue Mar 12, 2013 12:13 pm
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Post Re: Update - 9th March 2013
Zacchaeus wrote:
I imagine this rendition of Kure-ji's Deal was to add a challenge to an already easy game (sans the difficult quests that exist and Challenge Mode). There's a difference between "seemingly impossible" and "completely impossible". Kure-ji's Deal MKII is NOT completely impossible, and "seemingly impossible" is a debatable category to place this deal in. As I've stated before, I've been a stone's throw away once before. I see nothing that is disabling me from getting that close, again.

With that being said, the requirements are still ridiculous (take this as a compliment!), but me attempting to go through with a Troll Tier weapon to its completion means that it is far from even looking impossible. You just have to be willing to put forth the work to make it happen. Just like getting any weapon in this game that requires a little work.

As far as the vouchers go, I wouldn't say you're completely wasting your time, as spending said time in the casino to obtain the vouchers will be well worth the effort you put into getting one of these weapons. Trading for vouchers is also good yes, but that requires 20 to 25PDs a piece, like what most people have been doing, lately. At this rate, you could go either route-- either spending the time in the casino to get vouchers, or saving up enough Photon Drops to trade to get vouchers.

By doing that though, if you plan on sphering said weapon (If it isn't Troll Tier Excalibur), you're prolonging that opportunity. Oh, and...

-C00- wrote:
Docta if you're gonna put a "troll" tier up there, and yet make them seemingly impossible to get why would you put them into Kures in the first place.


I think the name of the Tier explains itself, with this one. :p


No, it doesn't.

I understand making the items themselves and the items needed to make them ridiculous. You know what, if you wanna do that, sure! But let's not make the means of getting them ridiculous. That's all I'm saying.

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